Is it possible?

[Keith]

??? Can a person who had a real relationship with Jesus walk away from their salvation and end up hearing the words, "Depart from Me," on Judgment Day???

I'd like to hear some of your responses before I put mine out there. Please give scripture references to back-up your view or opinion.

[Mark777]

Keith,

Look back a few pages for a thread called "Once Saved Always Saved". It covers a lot of territory - 92 pages.

Mark

[AFaceInTheCrowd]

No.John 10:28-29.I have heard folks say that we can take ourselves out of GOD's hands but the Word says "no one".To say that one can lose his salvation is saying that satan has greater power than GOD.

[Guest LadyC]

bloodbought, the context of the scripture you refer to is that no one can be snatched, i.e. taken against our will or without our knowledge, from God's hand. there's hundreds upon hundreds of scriptures that talk about apostasy, which is the ABANDONMENT of one's faith.

there are too many scriptures that have to be totally disregarded to uphold the theory of OSAS, because they are in direct conflict with the scriptures that say one can willingly choose to abandon their faith. yet none of the scriptures about apostates contradict in any way the ones used to support the osas doctrine.

[Guest man]

Matt. 7:21-22

There are so many other passages but it boils down to this....if you talk the talk but don't walk the walk, don't be surprised if you find yourself amongst the goats.

OSAS is a doctrine of the devil.

2 Corinthians 11:14-15

[Mark777]

Then I am a devil.

And if it is any other way other than OSAS - I'm not good enough to attain salvation or keep it. I think I will stick with OSAS, though. I might be a devil but I am a secure one.

Mark

[Floatingaxe]

??? Can a person who had a real relationship with Jesus walk away from their salvation and end up hearing the words, "Depart from Me," on Judgment Day???

I'd like to hear some of your responses before I put mine out there. Please give scripture references to back-up your view or opinion.

If He says that, then it may happen.

My view is that people certainly can renounce their faith..very serious.

Revelation 3 has some things to say about it. Revelation 3:5 tells me "He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels." The fact that he says that he will NOT blot out a name, tells me that He has that option. Further in Revelations 3, Jesus speaks to the lukewarm Laodicean church and in verse 16 he says, "So, because you are lukewarm

[RND]

Matt. 7:21-22

There are so many other passages but it boils down to this....if you talk the talk but don't walk the walk, don't be surprised if you find yourself amongst the goats.

OSAS is a doctrine of the devil.

2 Corinthians 11:14-15

I concur.

If your name is written in the Book of Life, how is it possible that it can be blotted out?

Revelation 3:5

He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

In other words, if you don't overcome your name can be blotted out of the Book of Life and your name will not be confessed to Father.

Exodus 32:33

And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

It is clear from Scripture that you can indeed have your name blotted out from under Heaven.

[rossj.anderson]

Matt. 7:21-22

One must consider their walk with the Lord.If we have fellowship with Him than we are walking in the light.

One can't live in a backslidden condition and expect to go to be with Jesus.

There are so many other passages but it boils down to this....if you talk the talk but don't walk the walk, don't be surprised if you find yourself amongst the goats.

OSAS is a doctrine of the devil.

2 Corinthians 11:14-15

I concur.

If your name is written in the Book of Life, how is it possible that it can be blotted out?

Revelation 3:5

He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

In other words, if you don't overcome your name can be blotted out of the Book of Life and your name will not be confessed to Father.

Exodus 32:33

And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

It is clear from Scripture that you can indeed have your name blotted out from under Heaven.

[HAZARD]

??? Can a person who had a real relationship with Jesus walk away from their salvation and end up hearing the words, "Depart from Me," on Judgment Day???

I'd like to hear some of your responses before I put mine out there. Please give scripture references to back-up your view or opinion.

_______________________________________________________________________

Believe it or not but Judas is actually a classic example of a man once saved then lost. There are many more such examples as Judas in the Scriptures. I have discussed this with several prominant board administrators and founders and many ministers, and to my surprise they fail to understand this despite the Scriptures plainly showing that a saved person who returnes to sin is lost unless they repent and return to Christ.

Judas had eternal life. He was a saved man. His name was written in the "Book of Life." Judas was a "Familiar Friend" of Christ who ate His bread (Psalm 41:9) Judas was not an enemy of Christ, but an equal in Grace, a guide, and a sweet acpuaintance; (Read these Scriptures for they are the truth, Psalms 55:12-13).

In Matt. 10 we have the facts recorded that Judas as one of the "twelve disciples" recieved power over demons, sickness and diseases and was called to preach the gospel. Of these twelve (Judas included) it is said that Christ gave them power and sent them forth, and commanded them to preach and to heal the sick. Jesus said to Judas and all the twelve, "Freely ye have recieved, freel give. . . and I send you forth as sheep . . . it shall not be ye that speak, but the spirit of your Father which speaketh in you" (Matt. 10:1-20).

These statements prove that Judas was once chosen and a genuine apostle. He was a true believer, a saved man, divinely empowered and equal in every sense with the others, a called preacher and a destroyer of Satans works. He was untill he sinned an obedient man, a sheep filled with the Spirit, and one who had God as his Father. In Mark 6:7-13 we read that the twelve (Judas included) went "forth two by two . . . and preached that men should repent. And they (Judas included) cast out demons and anointed with oil many that were sick, and healed them. This proves that Judas was a divinley efficient man, a sucessful preacher and had the power to heal.

If Judas was not a saved man, and if he could have done all these miracles as a lost sinner, then it would seem that the modern Christians who claim to be saved regardless of what they do should be able to do as much as Judas did whom they say was never saved.

It is insulting to Jesus Christ Himself and His Father in Heaven to accuse them of choosing an unsaved man to preach repentance and holiness, to heal the sick, to cast out demons, and the represent the Kingdom of God among men.

The only proof some men give to prove Judas was never saved is their OWN BELIEF that Judas was not a saved man at one time because he was FINALLY LOST.

Some cite John 6:64-70, but this passage does not say that Judas had at all times been a devil and unsaved. Jesus, in this Scripture was speaking of "some" of His disciples that believed not, and who should betray Him. The first part of this passage refers to the "some" that did not believe and does not include Judas. For after they had left Jesus JUDAS WAS STILL WITH THE TWELVE! whom Jesus asked, "Will ye also go away"???? See how easy it is to come to unsubstanciated conclusions!!! We must search the Scriptures like a bloodhound on the scent trail. Only the last part of this statement refers to Judas. Jesus knew who wdid not believe and He also knew who would betray Him. He did not say that Judas did not believe, nor that he was a devil from the beginning and therefore not a saved man.

The Holy Spirit through Luke records for us that JUDAS "BY TRANSGRESSION FELL" (Acts 1:15-25). Judas not only had a moral fall but "sin" caused it. Judas was not always a "devil" and a "thief." He became both after he had been saved for quite some time. Judas's weakness was the love of money and this caused his fall (John 12:6; Luke 22:5; Matt. 26:14-16). If he had refused to be treasurer of the first Christian disciples and had told them that money was his weakness, he would have been better off. Judas had seen Jesus escape the mob many times and he had no doubt the Lord would escape again and he would be thirty pieces better off.

It was not until the end of Christs ministry that Judas began to pilfer and to grow cold in his love of Christ. And it was not untill the last supper that the devil entered into his mind and became united in the same crime. Two days before the passover the devil put it into the heart of Judas to go top Christs enemies and betray Him. (Matt. 26:1-5, 14-16; John 13:2). It was at this time he openly broke away from christ AND SAUGHT THE OPPORTUNITY TO BETRAY HIM. Judas was sorry for his betrayal (Matt. 27:3-5), and he could have been forgiven as Peter was when he cursed God and denied Christ and fled like a coward at his test. But being of the disposition to do so Judas brooded over his sin and eventually yielded to satan to commit suicide. Judas then is a specific example of a New Testament man who was once saved and in God's favour and grace, but who lost this favour and went to Hell because of sin (Matt. 25:24 Acts 1:16-25).

Its this simple to understand. One cannot loose something we do not have! Jesus testified that to EVERY ONE [including Judas] the Father had given Him, He had given ETERNAL LIFE (John 17:2).

To deny Judas was once a saved man who lost his salvation is to deny Scripture and also deny Jesus Christs own statemens regarding Judas. Jesus also acknowledged to the Father that of those whom the Father had given Him Judas was the only one whom HE HAD LOST. Jesus Christ could not have LOST JUDAS HAD JUDAS NOT BEEN SAVED IN THE FIRST PLACE.! Judas had eternal life as much as the other apostles including Peter wo also denied Christ but he bacame "lost" and "by transgression fell" (Acts 1:25).

Not only were saved individuals warned to repent if they returned to sin, but entire churches were commanded by Jesus to repent or be lost. Many in the seven churches in Rev. 2-3 who WERE FALLEN from grace were repuired to repent and do their first works or else cut off in sin and be lost. Jesus was not a teacher of once in grace, or unconditional security always in grace and secure. He kept rebuking, warning, and commanding Christians to meet certain conditions if they were to be saved.

The Church at Ephesus, once in God's favour and grace at one time or it could not have fallen as indicated by Jesus Christ saying to it, I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love. "Remember therefore FROM WHENCE THOU ART FALLEN, [there it is, the entire church had fallen from grace], AND REPENT, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and I will remove thy candlestick out of its place, [and again Jesus warns] except thou repent" (Rev. 2:4-5). One losing his first love loses God, as is clear from 1 John 4:7-8 which shows that if one does not have love he does not have God. Anyone who does not have God or love, does not have grace. Having fallen from all of this, the church at Ephesus was ORDERED TO REPENT and do its first works, or have their candlestick removed, which means THE WHOLE CHURCH would be removed, for the candlestick represents the church (Rev. 1:20).

The church, completly destroyed for centuries, apparently did not return and do the first works again. As is the casewith any backslider, the latter end is worse that the beginning (Luke 11:24-26; 2 Peter 2:20-22). Christ demanded other churches to "repent" of idolatry, of comitting fornication, and adultery (Rev. 2:14-15, 19-24; 3:19), and He urged them to be on fire for God again, or be spewed out of "my mouth" (Rev. 3:15-16).

These and many other Scriptural, New Testament examples which have been given, and many more which can be shown plainly state that eternal life can be lost.