Beginning of time/ The Flood

[Pencil24]

I am just curious as to how anyone here truly knows that Creation is True and the Flood actually happened. Not because someone told you but that you know for sure from your own research. I think I can admit there is a God. Sometimes I have problems believing Genesis. Any suggestions are comments I welcome. 

[Jayne]

Hi, Pencil24 -

Both the Bible and geology purport that there was - initially - one continent.  Science calls it Pangea.  The Bible calls it "land".  What could have broken the land, or Pangea, up into 7 continents?  Well, a great flood, in which waters came from both the ground and the skies.  That water spewing from the ground could have caused a severe catastrophic effect that broke the earth into continents.  The Bible speaks very early of a man called "Peleg" and it says that during that time the earth was divided.

There's a lot more - are you looking for something specific or will general proofs do?

 

[Tzephanyahu]

2 hours ago, Pencil24 said:

I am just curious as to how anyone here truly knows that Creation is True and the Flood actually happened. Not because someone told you but that you know for sure from your own research. I think I can admit there is a God. Sometimes I have problems believing Genesis. Any suggestions are comments I welcome. 

Shalom Pencil24, 

I have created several pages detailing the proof of the flood for a non-believers and logical approach. Not only that, but it shiws that if the flood can be proved then evolution is disproved as a result. 

Please take the time to read through the evidence here: https://faithandtheword.com/book-a/idb/mind/real-argument/global-flood/

Love & Shalom 

[Pencil24]

2 hours ago, Jayne said:

Hi, Pencil24 -

Both the Bible and geology purport that there was - initially - one continent.  Science calls it Pangea.  The Bible calls it "land".  What could have broken the land, or Pangea, up into 7 continents?  Well, a great flood, in which waters came from both the ground and the skies.  That water spewing from the ground could have caused a severe catastrophic effect that broke the earth into continents.  The Bible speaks very early of a man called "Peleg" and it says that during that time the earth was divided.

There's a lot more - are you looking for something specific or will general proofs do?

 

I am open to whatever you would like to share. I have some family members who believe in science. I just need clarification for myself.

[Pencil24]

2 hours ago, Tzephanyahu said:

Shalom Pencil24, 

I have created several pages detailing the proof of the flood for a non-believers and logical approach. Not only that, but it shiws that if the flood can be proved then evolution is disproved as a result. 

Please take the time to read through the evidence here: https://faithandtheword.com/book-a/idb/mind/real-argument/global-flood/

Love & Shalom 

Thank you I have read some I saved it to notes on my phone and will finish it later.

[simplejeff]

6 hours ago, Pencil24 said:

I am just curious as to how anyone here truly knows that Creation is True and the Flood actually happened. Not because someone told you but that you know for sure from your own research. I think I can admit there is a God. Sometimes I have problems believing Genesis. Any suggestions are comments I welcome. 

To think that your own research will be beneficial to anyone,  in place of faith,  is almost always fatal.  (to faith and to any hope for life).

To trust or to rely on mankind's/ society's/  efforts, science, knowledge or methods is contrary to Yahweh's (God's) Way,  and results in curses. 

 

Believe Yahweh's Word because it is His Word,  and HE IS FAITHFUL and TRUE.  HE IS CREATOR.  JESUS IS SAVIOR.  period.

Yahweh Breathed His Word, Inspired His Word,  and Guards it even more than He Guards His Own Name.  There is no one else

to count on, no one else ever who can grant eternal life.

Looking to flesh, trusting in flesh,  results in death (to the soul and the body and the mind and the spirit).

Hebrews 6:13 When God made His promise to Abraham, since He ...

 

https://biblehub.com/hebrews/6-13.htm

Since there was no one greater to swear by, God took an oath in his own name, saying: English Standard Version For when God made a promise to Abraham, since he had no one greater by ... New American Standard Bible ... Since there was no one greater than himself, he used his own name when he made his vow.

 

Genesis 22:16 saying, "By Myself I have sworn, declares ... - Bible Hub

 

https://biblehub.com/genesis/22-16.htm

and said, "I swear by myself, declares the LORD, that because you have done .... When God made His promise to Abraham, since He had no one greater to ... Offer him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains, which I will show you."

 

HY

[Jayne]

Pencil24,

I was a science teacher for a while and I love genuine and true science.  True science and my Christian faith do not conflict.

Here's something to ponder on about the Great Flood.  [Bear with me until the end.]

• Remember, the Flood lasted a lot longer than 40 days and nights.  40 days and nights are how long the rains and waters from the deep lasted.  Noah and his family and land animals were on that Ark for over a year.  The waters still rose for a while after those 40 days and then when all the mountains were covered, God made the waters recede.  That took a while, too.

 

•  All that falling, churning, and rising of incredibly powerful water did much damage - catastrophically speaking.  So did the waters when they began to recede.  It broke the earth up, caused tectonic activity on a global scale - forming volcanos, including the Ring of Fire in the oceans, and caused the soils of the earth to turn to insanely massive swirls of sludge and mud that - in their immeasurable capacity - reshaped the earth.

 

•   When that sludge and mud began to settle, falling in layers according to granular size and creating the strata like we can see in so many places around the world, what we are left with are visible and researchable layers of the earth that contain fossils of the dead from the Flood.  Like here in the Painted Desert of Arizona.

 

•   These strata show simple organisms at the bottom and more complicated and higher order organisms at the top.  For the longest time we've been teaching that this proves evolution and the "millions of years" theory.

 

•   Others, creationists, teach that this could also be explained by lower order animals dying first in the Flood and more complicated creatures with more complicated brains and in-born instinct for flight - as in self-preservation being in the final layers - as they would flee to higher ground if possible.

 

•   Well, which is it?  If evolution were true, then there would be tons upon tons of transition fossils found in these layers - but there are none.  Literally - not one single one.  Not one fossil showing the transition from a grasshopper to a mouse to a lion.  Even scientists who don't believe in God will tell you that there are none.   Couple that with the fact that many animals of today - reptiles, amphibians, and mammals - are found in many of the strata with dinosaurs.  In LITERALLY the same form that they appear today.  Exactly.  Makes one question evolution - no?

 

•  And finally, couple THAT with the way that these creature from around the world are buried.  In mass graveyards of broken and whole, adult bodies.  As if some great and catastrophic event caused them to herd together and die en masse.  

 

As a Christian and as a science-lover, I had no problem with setting aside the opinion of others' and letting the evidence speak for itself.

 

 

[Deborah_]

10 hours ago, Pencil24 said:

I am just curious as to how anyone here truly knows that Creation is True and the Flood actually happened. Not because someone told you but that you know for sure from your own research. I think I can admit there is a God. Sometimes I have problems believing Genesis. Any suggestions are comments I welcome. 

Be aware that there are many many Christians who believe that the first few chapters of Genesis are not intended to be taken 'literally' (although they still believe them to be teaching truth) and see no fundamental problem in reconciling the Bible with science. But you won't find many such Christians on forums like this.

Quote

 

From chapter 12 onwards, Genesis contains stories of Abraham’s family, presumably handed down orally through the generations until written down by Moses. This should indeed be classified as ‘history’ - but we cannot therefore assume that chapters 1-11 are in the same category. Abraham is firmly rooted in both geography and history; the places where he lived are known to us, and we are given enough cultural detail to date him to around 2100 BC. We cannot say the same for Noah. Nor can we locate the Garden of Eden, despite the geographical information given; two of the rivers named are on different continents (Genesis 2:10-14)! It’s a bit like looking at one of those old maps, where America is missing but Australia fills the southern hemisphere, and recognisable places are mixed up with statements of “here be dragons” on uncharted territory. We run into similar problems when we try to integrate recent scientific discoveries with the accounts of creation in Genesis 1 and 2. We need a different approach altogether.

The stories in the first part of Genesis also have a very different ‘feel’ to those in the later chapters in the way they are narrated. The characters frequently have conversations with God (or with the devil, in Eve’s case), but rarely talk to each other. When they do speak, most of the recorded dialogue takes the form of prophetic pronouncements or ‘oracles’ e.g. Genesis 2:23; 4:23,24). This is not ‘real life’.

To summarise, Genesis 1-11 was written not to answer the question “What?” but “Why?” The author wanted to stimulate our imaginations, rather than follow the constraints of technical and historical accuracy; it may therefore be idle to wonder whether Eve actually had a conversation with a talking snake. Date and place are not important, because the truths being taught are spiritual, timeless and universal. And yet it would be a grave mistake to regard these stories as ‘fiction’… they describe real events.

Our spiritual prehistory, like our anthropological prehistory, is largely lost in the mists of time. The glimpses that we see through the veil are not clear ‘photographic’ images, such as we are accustomed to, but rather ‘artist’s impressions’. They should be interpreted accordingly.

 

 

[Jostler]

Heb 11:6

And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.

 

The world's problem is not an evidence issue, and no amount of evidence will convince a skeptic.  It's a belief issue and only the wooing of the Spirit can ultimately fix that.

Edited February 25, 2019 by Jostler

[simplejeff]

17 minutes ago, Jostler said:

Heb 11:6

And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.

 

The world's problem is not an evidence issue, and no amount of evidence will convince a skeptic.  It's a belief issue and only the wooing of the Spirit can ultimately fix that.

Right.   No worries about evidence.

 

Sometimes , perhaps often,  no 'wooing' ??  

 

Remembering FAITH is a GIFT,  granted by the Father Yahweh Creator Sovereign in all things.   

And He shows mercy to whomever He chooses to show mercy.   (Always in complete harmony with ALL HIS WORD) (He never contradicts Himself)

 

Romans 9:15 For He says to Moses: "I will have mercy on ... - Bible Hub

https://biblehub.com/romans/9-15.htm

For he says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion."

 

Romans 9:18 - Therefore God has mercy on whom ... - Bible Study Tools

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https://www.biblestudytools.com/romans/9-18-compare.html

Kehillah in Rome 9:18 (OJB) So then, to whom Hashem wills Hashem shows chaninah (mercy, free grace), but whom Hashem wills he hardens (that is, makes ...

 

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Romans 9:18 Therefore God has mercy on whom He ... - Bible Hub

 

https://biblehub.com/romans/9-18.htm

New International Version Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.

 

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Exodus 33:19
"I will cause all My goodness to pass in front of you," the LORD replied, "and I will proclaim My name--the LORD--before you. I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion."

Romans 9:16
So then, it does not depend on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy.