Killing And The Christian

[Guest]

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Defender's Name and Birthplace

White, Isaac (Alabama or Kentucky)

White, Robert (Unknown)

Williamson, Hiram James (Pennsylvania)

Wills, William (Unknown)

Wilson, David L. (Scotland)

Wilson, John (Pennsylvania)

Wolf, Anthony (Unknown)

Wright, Claiborne (North Carolina)

Zanco, Charles (Denmark)

John, A Black Freedman (Unknown)

End List ~

God Bless The Defenders Of Liberty

And God Bless America

God Bless Israel

Blessed is the nation whose God is the LORD: and the people whom he hath chosen for his own inheritance. Psalms 33:12

[jasoncran]

sigh. ask an american indian on why they call the christian faith the white man religion. afghanistan is coin mission. soldiers are dying to help poor muslims. hmm and yet we have americans here who are poor.

[jasoncran]

oh and i have been to afghanistan. i have been to war. if you doubt i can furnish my evidence.

[oldzimm]

sigh. ask an american indian on why they call the christian faith the white man religion. afghanistan is coin mission. soldiers are dying to help poor muslims. hmm and yet we have americans here who are poor.

Why did the Indian call "Christian Faith" the white mans religion..................Mmmmmm maybe because at that time to the American Indian it was the white mans religion, at the time it sure wasn't their religion. I might add, the word "religion" is one of my pet peeves, but that is a whole different story.

Apparently while you were fighting and helping those poor muslims, you weren't seeing the over all picture of the commander intent. I wasn't in Afghanistan (My son was), but I'm sure you seen the same thing there as I did in Iraq. You would be hard pressed to find common people here in the United States that live under the same conditions as common people in Iraq. Those people lived like rats in mud houses, in one of the most filthiest countries I have ever seen.

By helping these muslim people (and there were a few Iraqi Christians) to learn and make life better for themselves, to try and give birth to a democracy in their country (success remains to be seen), it can only help our home and national security. It took me about three or four months into the war before I could clearly see the importance of helping these people.

This transition isn't and won't be easy for them, I don't even know if it will work, time will tell. the Iraqi people didn't even know what freedom is, they were scared to death of it and democracy. (the unknown factor) The Iraqi's were so scared to death of Saddam and his sons, they kept pretty closed up until they truly believed we killed Saddam's sons and captured him.

It took our country 236 years of growing pains thus far and were still not done. We can't expect Iraq to turn on the light switch of democracy in ten years.

Brother Joe, thank you for posting the names of the men killed at the Alamo. What I found amazing, was these men came from all over the world, to the Alamo and unified, because they knew the importance of standing their ground, at all cost. (It was all God's plan)

[Fez]

@ jason It doesnt matter whether the "war" was legal or not, it doesnt negate what the men at the alamo did. Also, as far as it being an "illegal" war a good portion of it up to the point of the alamo, wasnt even fought by US Soldiers, but by texans rebelling against Mexican authority as it was part of Mexico. That was no different then the original 13 colonies rebelling against England. Thirdly, Lincoln had no real say in the matter about Texas-he wasn't even the president, the president at the time was Andrew Jackson.

You know how wrong that statement actually comes across?

It says that a bunch of interlopers moved onto Mexican owned land, did not like the authority of the land they were occupying, and so decided to remove the original inhabitants, to "win" independence. A land grab by any other definition...

[enoob57]

@ jason It doesnt matter whether the "war" was legal or not, it doesnt negate what the men at the alamo did. Also, as far as it being an "illegal" war a good portion of it up to the point of the alamo, wasnt even fought by US Soldiers, but by texans rebelling against Mexican authority as it was part of Mexico. That was no different then the original 13 colonies rebelling against England. Thirdly, Lincoln had no real say in the matter about Texas-he wasn't even the president, the president at the time was Andrew Jackson.

You know how wrong that statement actually comes across?

It says that a bunch of interlopers moved onto Mexican owned land, did not like the authority of the land they were occupying, and so decided to remove the original inhabitants, to "win" independence. A land grab by any other definition...

MG'^s gonna get you Fez....

[CompleteAgape]

On 4/26/2012 at 1:19 PM, The_Patriot2016 said:

Obvious flaw with this line of thought, God sent the Israelites to war repeatedly-told them to kill all the canaanites in fact, men, women, and children. He also instituted the death penalty. So, if your argument is christians should never kill for any reason because God said not to, then we have a problem-how can a God who sent tge isrealites to war then turn around and condemn it? The answer is he didnt. The actual commandment is better translated thou shalt not murder. There is a distinct difference between killing someone in cold blood, and killing someone in self defense or in protection of ones country. Theres a time for peace and theres a time for war. Wisdom tells you which.

As Christians the directions and examples of how God's people in the Old Testament do not apply to us.  If one is to follow the laws of the OT then one must follow all, not pick which ones you like.  Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy have many rites and commands that you should follow.  This does not make you a Christian but a Jew.  God has spoken to His people today not through Moses or the prophets; He has spoken to His people on how to live through Jesus.  The OT is not applicable for Christians on how to live our lives.  It is applicable for knowledge, understanding, and how Jesus came about.

[The_Patriot21]

34 minutes ago, CompleteAgape said:

As Christians the directions and examples of how God's people in the Old Testament do not apply to us.  If one is to follow the laws of the OT then one must follow all, not pick which ones you like.  Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy have many rites and commands that you should follow.  This does not make you a Christian but a Jew.  God has spoken to His people today not through Moses or the prophets; He has spoken to His people on how to live through Jesus.  The OT is not applicable for Christians on how to live our lives.  It is applicable for knowledge, understanding, and how Jesus came about.

aaaah another person who likes to revive dying threads. Well, actually you are both correct, and incorrect my friend. Jesus did not do away with the old covenant, he fulfilled it, theres a big difference, which means we no longer bound to live by it-I.E. no more sacrifices to make up for your sins etc. However, that doesnt mean the law is to be ignored. Let us look at what scripture says about it:

 

Romans 7:7

What then shall we say? That the law is sin? By no means! Yet if it had not been for the law, I would not have known sin. For I would not have known what it is to covet if the law had not said, “You shall not covet.”

So you see, the law is not dead or to be ignored! We are saved by grace, yes indeed, but saved from what? sin. well, how do you know what sin is? you have to have a definition of sin, well, we do, its the law-and its in the Old Testament. IF the law says it is sin, then it is sin! it makes the old testament very applicable to how we live! sure, we dont offer animal sacrifices anymore-Jesus did do away with that by offering Himself as the ultimate sacrifice-but that doesnt mean the law is moot, in fact, if we could disregard the OT and the law, then it makes Jesus sacrifice a moot point-because without a definition of sin, there is no sin, and no reason for Christ to have died for us! You are absolutly right in saying that we cannot pick and choose what scripture we want to listen to and what we can't! that includes ALL of scripture. You cant ignore the old testament! Even the New Testament, tells you not to!

Let us go back to scripture!

2 Timothy 3:16

All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,

 

[CompleteAgape]

On 11/20/2016 at 10:03 PM, The_Patriot2016 said:

aaaah another person who likes to revive dying threads. Well, actually you are both correct, and incorrect my friend. Jesus did not do away with the old covenant, he fulfilled it, theres a big difference, which means we no longer bound to live by it-I.E. no more sacrifices to make up for your sins etc. However, that doesnt mean the law is to be ignored. Let us look at what scripture says about it:

 

Romans 7:7

What then shall we say? That the law is sin? By no means! Yet if it had not been for the law, I would not have known sin. For I would not have known what it is to covet if the law had not said, “You shall not covet.”

So you see, the law is not dead or to be ignored! We are saved by grace, yes indeed, but saved from what? sin. well, how do you know what sin is? you have to have a definition of sin, well, we do, its the law-and its in the Old Testament. IF the law says it is sin, then it is sin! it makes the old testament very applicable to how we live! sure, we dont offer animal sacrifices anymore-Jesus did do away with that by offering Himself as the ultimate sacrifice-but that doesnt mean the law is moot, in fact, if we could disregard the OT and the law, then it makes Jesus sacrifice a moot point-because without a definition of sin, there is no sin, and no reason for Christ to have died for us! You are absolutly right in saying that we cannot pick and choose what scripture we want to listen to and what we can't! that includes ALL of scripture. You cant ignore the old testament! Even the New Testament, tells you not to!

Let us go back to scripture!

2 Timothy 3:16

All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,

 

I didn't say the Old Law was dead or even to be ignored.  You want to pick and choose what laws you are to follow.  Therefore; if your child or a child is disobedient then it is justified by the law that they are killed.  I doubt you believe that you or any Christian should follow this command.  Again, you can not pick and choose what laws you are to follow.  We follow Christ, very simple.  We know what sin is through Jesus, NOT the Old Law.  If you are to follow the Old Law and make it applicable to how you live today as a Christian then you must follow ALL of it.  Read Leviticus, Numbers, & Deuteronomy and according to your argument to be consistent you must follow those commands.  I agree with 2 Timothy 3:16 however the Old Law and prophets do not dictate how God's people are to live today. This is one of the reasons He came to earth as a man, Jesus, to show us through His words and actions how we are to live. 

[The_Patriot21]

I think that scripture is true-if scripture says that the law defines what sin is, then that is what sin is. What Jesus did, was relieve us of the consequences of the sin. You bring up an absurd point. First off I'm pretty sure the law does not say to kill disobedient children.

But even if it did, yes obviously, we don't kill the child, BUT it is still a sin for the child to disobey, so your point is irrelevant. The law defines what sin is. That is what scripture teaches. We are no longer bound by it-were not going to be stoned for adultery, nor do we need to make animal sacrifices, but it does tell us what sin. 

I my friend am not picking and choosing anything. I am following scripture in its entirety, and ad you can see that is what the Bible teaches. You are no longer arguing with me but God.